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The "I am conflicted" Gruit
  • Evan_BEvan_B
    Posts: 312
    I am conflicted!!!!!!!!!

    With spring on it's way (knock on wood) I have been thinking more and more about trying a gruit ale. After a little research at the local hippy store I have found these "common" gruit herbs that are available to me:
    Yarrow Flower
    Rose Hips
    Chamomile (duh)
    Juniper Berries (dried)

    My real question is regarding the grist. I was going to just use some pale malt, a little crystal and honey at first, but I think it would be better to use an existing grist from a previous beer. "HEY!!! I'll use that Rye IPA grist and take out the hops... Ohhhhhh, but I could also use that Dry Stout Grist, which is relatively light, and finishes pretty dry (per the style, haha)."

    Also, I think my primary herb-age is going to be Yarrow Flower and Juniper berries.
    I just can't decide whether or not I should stick with the Rye IPA grist, or join the dark side and given the Dry Stout grist a shot.

    Oh yeah ....

    Rye IPA
    61% 2-row
    21% White Wheat
    7% Rye Malt
    1% C-60L
    1% Victory



    Dry Stout
    72% 2-row
    18% Flaked Rye
    9% Roasted Barley
    1% Acid Malt (I would cut this out for the gruit)



    Grrrrrrr...
    I appreciate any and all ideas/opinions.
    Amigo, lay them raises down.
  • ThymThym
    Posts: 103,796
    I've never experimented with any of these flavors in brewing so i'm really not sure where to go with it. i bet @ceannt has some well formed opinions.

    my gut says the rye ipa grain bill would work well. the earthy tones of rye should pair well with the herbs. getting an uber dry finish would be my only concern. might want to mash low and slow.
    The only thing between me and a train wreck is blind luck..... - Kenny
  • Evan_BEvan_B
    Posts: 312
    My problem is I have all these ideas I want to experiment with, and I have never actually tried a gruit, haha.

    I think you're right though with the Rye grist. For simplicity sake I would probably lose the c-60 and victory.

    I guess I just need to SLOW DOWN, and try to make a decent gruit before I try making some crazy and off the wall.
    Amigo, lay them raises down.
  • ThymThym
    Posts: 103,796
    that would really be my suggestion, take a simple grain bill for which you are pretty familiar with the character, then delta off of that, so you can get a feel for what flavors are coming through
    The only thing between me and a train wreck is blind luck..... - Kenny
  • Evan_BEvan_B
    Posts: 312
    Lakewood said:

    that would really be my suggestion, take a simple grain bill for which you are pretty familiar with the character, then delta off of that, so you can get a feel for what flavors are coming through



    Yeah, thats a good idea. Thank you!
    Amigo, lay them raises down.
  • ThymThym
    Posts: 103,796
    and of course report back with your learnin's
    The only thing between me and a train wreck is blind luck..... - Kenny
  • Evan_BEvan_B
    Posts: 312
    Lakewood said:

    and of course report back with your learnin's



    naturally
    Amigo, lay them raises down.
  • ceanntceannt
    Posts: 48,486
    I like the rye too....
    The yarrow and juniper berries would work good, go easy on the yarrow... and toss in a couple grams of sweet gale.....
    add all the herbies late in the boil.... 'cept the juniper berries, put them in the mash.
    In wine there is wisdom.
    In beer there is freedom.
    In water there is bacteria.
  • frydogbrewsfrydogbrews
    Posts: 44,679
    i made a yarrow and sweet gale beer once.

    worst. beer. ever.

    then it got infected and smelled/tasted like stinky cheese and then bottles started exploding. this caused a slight "rough patch" in the marriage as stinky cheese bottles exploded all over my basement....
  • ceanntceannt
    Posts: 48,486

    i made a yarrow and sweet gale beer once.

    worst. beer. ever.

    then it got infected and smelled/tasted like stinky cheese and then bottles started exploding. this caused a slight "rough patch" in the marriage as stinky cheese bottles exploded all over my basement....



    =))

    sounds like my "great Lager disaster of 1991".....
    In wine there is wisdom.
    In beer there is freedom.
    In water there is bacteria.
  • C_BC_B
    Posts: 77,639

    i made a yarrow and sweet gale beer once.

    worst. beer. ever.

    then it got infected and smelled/tasted like stinky cheese and then bottles started exploding. this caused a slight "rough patch" in the marriage as stinky cheese bottles exploded all over my basement....



    Ha! Eww.
    "On it. I hate software." ~Cpt Snarklepants
  • ceanntceannt
    Posts: 48,486
    it is really, really easy to overshoot most herbs.....
    I would go with the ryePA recipe... but loose the crystal, use biscuit instead of victory, and add either a half pound or so of Brown Malt, or around three oz of chocolate malt... mash fairly high, say between 156 and 158 and add some treacle (if you can get it) or molassass...
    juniper berries you can add up to an ounce in the mash...
    everything else, put in a bag and toss in with 15 min. left in the boil.... and take it easy... anything more than a couple grams of anything else listed will overpower
    In wine there is wisdom.
    In beer there is freedom.
    In water there is bacteria.
  • ceanntceannt
    Posts: 48,486
    oh.... and that is for a five gallon batch, so if you are doing your normal 3 gallons... scale it back!!!!
    In wine there is wisdom.
    In beer there is freedom.
    In water there is bacteria.
  • jlwjlw
    Posts: 16,417
    I don't even know what a gruit is.
  • ceanntceannt
    Posts: 48,486
    jlw said:

    I don't even know what a gruit is.



    Two responses are appropriate
    I'll tell you when you're older
    or
    go ask your mother ....
    In wine there is wisdom.
    In beer there is freedom.
    In water there is bacteria.
  • Evan_BEvan_B
    Posts: 312
    ceannt said:

    it is really, really easy to overshoot most herbs.....
    I would go with the ryePA recipe... but loose the crystal, use biscuit instead of victory, and add either a half pound or so of Brown Malt, or around three oz of chocolate malt... mash fairly high, say between 156 and 158 and add some treacle (if you can get it) or molassass...
    juniper berries you can add up to an ounce in the mash...
    everything else, put in a bag and toss in with 15 min. left in the boil.... and take it easy... anything more than a couple grams of anything else listed will overpower



    Awesome! Thanks for the tips. I think I will actually just do a one gallon batch to see what it is going to be like, so I will scale back a lot, haha.
    Amigo, lay them raises down.
  • Evan_BEvan_B
    Posts: 312
    I think the best thing to do is to grow all the herbs in my yard first and then brew with them... all for the sake of naming it iGruit
    Amigo, lay them raises down.
  • C_BC_B
    Posts: 77,639
    Evan_B said:

    iGruit



    no.
    "On it. I hate software." ~Cpt Snarklepants
  • Evan_BEvan_B
    Posts: 312
    C_dubbs said:

    Evan_B said:

    iGruit



    no.


    Dang. I was so pumped when that popped in my head. Stupid apple.
    Amigo, lay them raises down.
  • C_BC_B
    Posts: 77,639
    Evan_B said:

    C_dubbs said:

    Evan_B said:

    iGruit



    no.


    Dang. I was so pumped when that popped in my head.
    Ha!
    Evan_B said:

    Stupid apple.

    And yes.

    "On it. I hate software." ~Cpt Snarklepants
  • jlwjlw
    Posts: 16,417
    ceannt said:

    jlw said:

    I don't even know what a gruit is.



    Two responses are appropriate
    I'll tell you when you're older
    or
    go ask your mother ....


    aww man.
  • ceanntceannt
    Posts: 48,486
    jlw said:

    ceannt said:

    jlw said:

    I don't even know what a gruit is.



    Two responses are appropriate
    I'll tell you when you're older
    or
    go ask your mother ....


    aww man.


    Ha!

    gruit is an un-hopped ale... brewed with herbs... the "classic" trio is Bog Myrtle, wild rosemary and yarrow. At one time the church (Rome) had control of the gruit herbs and hops were against the law in England.... the main reason old Henry split with Rome was not so he could get a divorce as is commonly believed, but because he liked hops in his beer.....
    In wine there is wisdom.
    In beer there is freedom.
    In water there is bacteria.
  • jlwjlw
    Posts: 16,417
    interesting. I would have to try one before I made one.
  • ceanntceannt
    Posts: 48,486
    jlw said:

    interesting. I would have to try one before I made one.



    Good idea .....
    In wine there is wisdom.
    In beer there is freedom.
    In water there is bacteria.
  • ThymThym
    Posts: 103,796
    so when is this brew happening?
    The only thing between me and a train wreck is blind luck..... - Kenny
  • scoobscoob
    Posts: 16,617
    jlw said:

    interesting. I would have to try one before I made one.



    Never seen one for sale
    Lakewood said:

    so when is this brew happening?


    Yes, this, then send me one so I can see if it tastes like stinky foot cheese.
    Jesus didn't wear pants